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YHWH continues to bless my life as I
continue to seek His Face & Will. Kevin & I have been
married nearly 3 years now. I have changed my name, in keeping
with my 'new creature' status to:
Shalom Serene Shick.
I really
covet Yah's 'Shalom' in my life, and it is one of my challenges to be
'Serene. My old names both had distinct pagan origins, although,
of course, it wasn't my mother's intent. But I was most proud of
them when I was Wiccan, and now I want to make the change that Abraham,
Peter and others all made when they had their names changed upon
embarking on the Lord's Way. I went right down to the court house
and got the opportunity to give my testimony to several people as I
explained my purpose in changing my name.
Kevin & I have gotten certified
as Health Ministers by Hallelujah Acres! We really are enjoying
our new diet and lifestyle as we glorify God in our bodies which are His
Temple for His Holy Spirit. Kevin has lost 20 pounds and kicked
the caffeine habit, and I have quit smoking at last. Check out our
site at
 for lots of useful information and tips.
Continued top of
next column above.
Listen to an interview with Jennifer
Smee of the Congregation at Shomair Yisrael about Witchcraft and it's
infuence on our children:
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YHWH leads me closer and closer to Him. I am now
attending a lovely Messianic Congregation,
Shomair Yisrael, here in
Knoxville. I am very excited about participating in the same
glorious festivals our Messiah practiced! Yom Kippur and Sukkot
were really great. I put my air mattress and sleepy bags out on
the roof of the apartment I rent out, outside my bedroom, for a little Sukkah. It got too cold the last few nights, though, and I had to
wimp out. But the nights that I was able to sleep and eat out
there were so special. I really felt like maybe I was making Abba
smile at my little gesture. It also gave me a chance to talk to a
few folks about what I was doing, so a bit of witnessing ensued as a
result, too.
Little did I know that when I changed my name to
'Shalom' I had created an opportunity for a pretty funny inside joke
upon going to the Messianic Congregation. Several people,
especially our Rabbi at Shomair Yisrael, enjoy
greeting me with: 'Shalom, Shalom!' It really tickles me.
I almost feel like Hilkiah in 2 Chronicles, when he was
read the newfound Torah and realized how he and his people and ancestors
had not been following YHVH's Commands. He tore his clothing and
determined to change that situation. It seems to me that so many
of us are missing out on what our God wants us to be doing by assuming
that His Law no longer applies since Jesus' Sacrifice. It is my
understanding that the only law this pre-empted was the one for sin
sacrifice, as His was the once and for all sacrifice for our sins.
Jesus told us He did not come to end the Law but to fulfill it.
Jesus followed the Law, and as He is our example, I think we should
follow it as well. Jesus was a Jew. He practiced Judaism.
He did not come to start a new religion. No wonder Jews don't want
to convert. Their faith is true, up to the point of not
recognizing their Messiah, and they know about the Truth that is in it,
and in them as the chosen people of YHVH. Christianity asks them
to deny their Jewishness in order to follow Jesus. This is
ridiculous.
I am thinking about making some tzit-tzit, since I found
a kewl site online with a video that shows how easy it is.How
to Make Tassels Seems like it might be a way to get witnessing
opportunities with Jewish folk, who would likely recognize them and be
curious as to why some goy was wearing them. I think it helps to
be able to tell a Jew that they can still be Jewish and know Yeshua.
I love Jesus' Hebrew Name:
Yeshua. It is what His
friends and family called Him. I like to be able to have that kind
of familiarity with Him.
I read a really excellent trilogy recently: The Christ
Clone Trilogy. Way strange premise, but awesome research for a
riveting story. There is some great apologetics in there, as well
as the most compelling description of how easy it will be to fall for
the AntiChrist. This stuff is right out of the pagan/wiccan
literature I fell for. I really think that is how it will all come
down. This person is going to seem like the most fabulous thing to
happen to the world ever. He will be lovable and intelligent and
seemingly compassionate and good. Oh, we must be on our toes.
Read that trilogy for some important insight.
02/18/07 It appears that many prayers for healing are
being answered. I have been diagnosed with hypothyroidism.
Now this is really very good as you will see shortly. Keep in mind
that in early December, just a couple of months ago, there was a call to
the congregation at Shomair Yisrael to come up for anointing with oil
for healing requests. I went and in just a few days found the
information on the internet that led to this information. Please
find this news at www.supernaturalself.com/Hypothyroid
Defending the Faith
Here is an interesting exchange I
have had with a fellow on YouTube that made a disparaging comment on my video
Testimony. Please pray that the Holy Spirit will soften his heart to come
to the Truth and Salvation!
Scroll to the bottom and read each
post going up for chronological sequence.
Of course there were tons of references to Yeshua's Return in nearly every
book of the New Covenant! Yeshua Himself told us He would come again, for
goodness sake!
My favorite is this one:
(2 Peter 3:1-13)
1 This is now, beloved, the second letter I am writing to you in which I am
stirring up your sincere mind by way of reminder, 2 that you should remember the
words spoken beforehand by the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and
Savior spoken by your apostles.
3 Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their
mocking, following after their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of
His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was
from the beginning of creation.”
5 For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God
the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water,
6 through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water.
7 But the present heavens and earth by His word are being reserved for fire,
kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8 But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord
one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is
not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,
not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
So you see, this entire discussion is of His Second Coming. You will also note
that it is NOT all about the Jews, but all people when He states 'not wishing
for any to perish but for ALL to come to repentance'. He's waiting for people
like you to get it. There is no support for your statements that it is all about
the Jews. Even in the Old Covenant He tells Avrahim that He will bless ALL
people through his line, signifying His Plan to do so through Yeshua. And, in
the New Covenant, Yeshua Himself describes how the Gentiles are 'grafted in'
Yeshua said of his purpose, "I came that they may have life, and have it
abundantly." Even during the final moments before Yeshua died hanging on the
Cross, He said, "It is finished." What He came that time to do was done. First
John 3:8 says, "&For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might
destroy the works of the devil." The Adversary is now a defeated foe. The Work
has been done that makes it so. The whole story isn't over, but the Primary Work
to bring it to completion has been accomplished by Yeshua.
Hebrews 2:5: And also that He might deliver and completely set free all those
who through the [haunting] fear of death were held in bondage throughout the
whole course of their lives.
Note it says ALL, not the Jews.
Yeshua says in John 6:38, "For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will,
but the will of him that sent me." He came to do the will of His Father who sent
Him. That will of the Father was nothing less than to secure the salvation of
all that the Father gave to Him, both now and eternally. He said, in verse 39,
"And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath
given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day."
Please, again, keep in mind that Yeshua IS YHVH/God. So we are not simply
talking human sacrifice here. We are talking, as Yeshua explained, the greatest
thing anyone can do: laying one's own life down for a friend. That is what YHVH
did: not human sacrifice of His human Son, but laying His Own Life down for us.
All of us, not just the Jews.
In fact, Sha'ul/Paul explained the 'grafting in' of the Gentiles, which was
another purpose of His Birth. Also,
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the
middle wall of partition between us;
Shalom means more than "peace." Moreover, Yeshua living in both believing
Gentiles and Jews is what has made us both one. The m'chitzah (that which
divides something in half) (partition) is now broken in half. The same idea is
carried in Gal. 3:28 by saying there is neither male nor female nor Jew or Greek
(Technical word for Gentile) in Messiah. If a Gentile has become a true
believer, he is joined to Israel and a partaker of the Covenants. A full-fledged
citizen. Otherwise not. Sha'ul is saying that this boundary fence is done away
in Messiah. No longer is there a court for women and no longer do women have
second-class citizenship nor or they separated onto one side in the churches or
synagogues. The same is true of Gentile believers. Just as the veil of the
Temple was torn in two when the Messiah died (Matthew 27:52), allowing everyone
united with the Messiah to enter into the Holy of Holies (a privilege previously
reserved for the Cohen Gadol (High Priest) we who are united with Messiah our
Cohen Gadol may enter into the Holy of Holies with Him. In this way, Sha'ul is
saying that Yeshua has removed the barrier of Believing Gentiles mixing with and
being counted with G-d's people. They are no longer held in the Court of the
Gentiles but may enter into the Temple proper.
BTW, I 'said the prayer' and went to church occasionally when I was a kid up to
mid-teens myself, so I was a 'Christian' of sorts before I became Wiccan. So it
took me over 20 years to come back around, and I scoffed and argued just as
vehemently as you are doing all through that time, feeling quite certain that
Christianity was an evil, ignorant path. But when I REALLY began to study,
prayerfully asking the Ultimate Creative Force (as I then understood Him) to
show me the Truth, I started finding things that totally disrupted my prior
perspectives. It is then that those 'seeds' patient Believers had planted all
through the years finally grew up and produced fruit. So, yes it can make a
diff, despite your protests to the contrary.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
But thats the problem! Before the formation of the catholic church there was
never any claim of a second coming. That was invented to cover up for Jesus'
failings.
Saying that I will one day die is not a prophecy, its a fact. Saying someone
will one day come and do a number of specific tasks is a prophecy. Heres the
difference; facts have evidence to support them (i.e. billjohn is a human,
all humans die) prophecies have no evidence until they are fulfiled.
I understand what you're trying to say though your example was poor. A
better example is that a prophecy was made saying billjohn will one day have
children. Now this is both possible but not guaranteed (just likely). Now if
we add in the idea that I couldn't be the billjohn the prophecy was talking
about unless I have children (and therefore don't die or something before I
do so) we have a basis for arguement about the billjohn in question. If I
fulfil the prophecy on all levels then its a fair enough assumption to
believe I am the billjohn in question. If I fail on some level (i.e. I
empregnate a female but due to complications it ends in misscarriage) then I
can't be the billjohn in question. I might come close (i.e. I have the name
and could do it) but if I still fail then I'm not the billjohn of the
prophecy.
Lets take this to the claims around Jesus. Now I believe in a divine and I
believe in magick and spritiuality. So even if I were to accept the claims
about Jesus' life I'm still stuck at a simple wall. The whole purpose of the
Messiah is NOT to bring about forgiveness and redemption (if he were to do
that it'd only be a side job for him), no, the purpose of the Messiah is to
end the world and reward the Jews for being Jewish. Not come here make some
promises and bugger off again only to return and finish the job later. Its
meant to be a one off gig. The Messiah is meant to come bless the Jews and
rain down racist damnation on all others. End of story.
As I said before the invention of the second coming was made up to cover up
for Jesus' failing. Also no seeds have been planted, I was a christian once
and I will never go back to that hell (pun intended) again. We don't need to
continue this if you don't want to all I want is for you to accept that in
my eyes Jesus (yeshua) and the whole concept of a "God" that demands human
sacrifice inorder to forgive humans is both disgusting and evil. I would
happily chose oblivion and all the suffering that entails over accepting
such a vile creature as my Lord. But thankfully we don't live in a reality
where such a monster rules.
Thanks for reading
Billjohn69
Here is the simple answer: not all prophecy has been fulfilled as we are not
at the end yet. The story is not over. If you study the Feasts and how they
foreshadow what is to come, it becomes clear:
http://www.lamblion.com/articles/articles_jews3.php
Here's an example:
It is prophesied that billjohn is going to die someday. billjohn is not dead
yet, but that does not mean that he is not billjohn. Get it?
The prophecies that He has fulfilled, that I sent you earlier, are
statistically impossible, which is yet another gargantuan indication that He
IS Messiah.
The Adversary has you, and is going to keep you (and all scoffers) in a
state of confusion because you really do not want to know the truth. You
just want to try to disprove it (which you'll never do). You think you're
making headway but you're not. If you really wanted to learn, you'd accept
that which has been clearly explained to you and search for answers to the
rest. You sir, do not do that.
Here's what the truth about you is; Forget your hypotheses:
1 Corinthians 2 v 13This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human
wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in
spiritual words.[c] 14The man without the Spirit does not accept the things
that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he
cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.
I used to be just like you this way. When I began to sincerely seek the
Truth, it was as though scales fell away from my eyes. Not immediately, but
as a process. I know, though, that the conversations I'd had with folks like
you & I are having now did plant seeds that one day came to fruition. I
don't want to spend my time going back and forth with you on this, but I do
feel the prompting of the Ruach to do so, and I am obedient. I continue to
pray for you as those others did for me. And all because I sense that the
Hound of Heaven is after you (google this intriguing poem titled Hound of
Heaven). And that someday you will be brought to surrender before the King.
I only pray it is before it is too late.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
I want to share something with you that really blew my
mind when I heard of it a year or so ago:
God's Holy Name, YHVH, as I'm sure you know, is
comprised of the Hebrew letters yod-hey-vav-hey. Hebrew
letters are similar to Egyptian hieroglyphs in that they
are word pictures, i.e., each letter was originally a
picture of something.
Yod= Hand
Hey= behold
Vav= Nail
So we have, essentially, "Behold the nailed hand!"
This strikes me as amazing proof that Yeshua/Jesus IS
YHVH, that He had foreknowledge of how He would save
mankind, and that this alien being communicated this to
us for proof through the Name He chose to tell
Moshe/Moses long before Yeshua walked the planet!
Just food for thought.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
...
Getting stuff to show you from the christian point of veiw is
proving near impossible but I figured if I show you the stuff
about the Jewish eschatology ("end of the world stories") and
therefore prove Jesus wasn't the Messiah then thats all thats
really needed.
The Jewish "book of Isaiah" covers most of the claims about what
the Messiah is meant to do. There were a number of things in
there that Jesus acclaimedly did do but there were many failings
which prove he wasn't the Jewish Messiah, for example.
There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease
(Isaiah 25:8)
All of the dead will rise again (Isaiah 26:19)
The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness
(Isaiah 51:11)
Evil and tyranny will not be able to stand before his leadership
(Isaiah 11:4)
(Quotes taken from the Tanakh (english version))
As we know hunger, illness and death still persist to this day.
The dead did not rise. The Jews are not experiencing eternal
joy/gladness and alot of evil and tyranny is done in Jesus'
name.
A few other claims about what the Messiah is meant to do comes
from other books in the Tanakh.
The peoples of the world will turn to the Jews for spiritual
guidance (Zechariah 8:23)
Weapons of war will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9)
Jews will know the Torah without Study (Jeremiah 31:33)
Feel free to do the research yourself but I can guarantee you
Jesus did not do these things/bring about these things and they
were pretty much the whole purpose of the Messiah. So no matter
what Jesus may have been or may have claimed, he was not the
Messiah. Just a Jew who died nailed to a bit of wood and gave
birth to a religion of racism, fear, hatred and general evil.
Thanks for reading.
Billjohn69.
P.S. don't go giving the usual Christian fall-back crap of
"Those quotes are out of context!". Read the whole thing if you
need to but don't go trying to force such nonsense on me. They
mean exactly what I've said they mean. Jesus couldn't have been
the Messiah (Mashiach or Moshiach).
Jan 17, 2010
I look forward to what you may deign to send in future, if anything.
You don't have to care about me. The Ruach HaChodesh enables me to care
about you, HalleluYah!
Blessings with love,
Shalom
I know I've not responded in a while and its going to be a
while yet before I get anything worth while to you. Asking
for references to what I know about christianity is a little
difficult for 2 reasons.
1; I never learned this stuff to try and teach others, only
to help myself get over my christian upbringing. As such
this is stuff I've learned over the course of almost eleven
years and never bookmarked any websites or kept track of the
books I used. Once I had (what I felt was) enough evidence
for something I'd memorise it and be happy with that. Just
as I've learned just about everything else in this world be
it about science, maths, literature, etc.
2; Many christians are nuts and their work is nonsense.
(i.e. most seem to not understand that writings exist from
Jesus' time (including a fabled "Q" document which is a
handwriten script of Jesus' teachings made by the man
himself) and instead insist that Greek works based on Paul's
(mis)translations are the most accurate in the world, which
is wrong) This makes finding websites that have both the
information I'm looking for and that you'll accept very
difficult. Plus theres no way I'll be able to show you some
of the physical older texts to back up my claims.
As such I'm finding it difficult to prove to you that Jesus
failed to be the Messiah, etc. Not because I'm wrong but
because gathering the info in a way I think you'll
understand is proving more difficult than I had thought it
would be.
I get back to you as soon as I have something worth showing
you (if I can be bothered, after all my original comment was
to point out that you weren't a Wiccan. I don't really care
about you enough since you chose to buy into a racist
religion after everything you claim they did to you), but
honestly the best results come from personnal research. As I
said before the Jewish "end of the world stories" are quite
clear. The Jewish Messiah is to end the world on his first
and only coming. Jesus didn't do that and therefore couldn't
have been the Messiah.
Thanks for reading.
Billjohn69
Re: 2nd message; read after the other one.
What I don't think you understand is the omniscient nature of YHVH. His
ability to see the 'big picture'. We don't have that ability. I'm sure
you have noticed that sometimes when something goes terribly wrong,
after time has passed and you have a longer view of the circumstances,
you are able to see that it was the best possible thing that could have
happened? Here is a little story to illustrate:
Man shipwrecked on desert island spends years building his little
hut/home. He makes tools and implements to cook with and furniture to
try to gain some comfort in his isolation. One night he is sitting by
his campfire, and it begins to rain. As if that isn't bad enough,
lightening strikes his hut and it burns everything in it as well. He is
devastated. He cries out to God, "Why?!" About that time a ship arrives
to save him. They tell him they saw the fire and were drawn there to
investigate. So what he'd thought was the worst possible thing was
actually the best.
YHVH can see how everything is connected and will turn out. He is the
ultimate 'chess player' seeing zillions of moves ahead. He knows that
giving His own life (yes, it was His Son, but Yeshua was the human
manifestation of YHVH and was YHVH) for us was the best way to make this
whole show work out in the end. No one else can do this. Particularly no
human with their finite little mind.
Your father sounds like someone who is probably better off gone. I don't
know and cannot judge, but from what you have said, his life was
probably pretty miserable. When folks make the choices for evil, I can
understand how 'oblivion' is actually a mercy for them. They aren't
going to change their minds and become good in many cases. And YHVH
knows this. But He still loves them. Just like you still love your
father.
You are allowed to judge YHVH. You have free will. And He will forgive
you for it when you realize you were wrong. Because He loves you. And He
knows you, like so many others, have been lied to by people who said
they were Christians, but probably were not. If you bothered to read my
testimony on my SavedXWitch site, you would know that I had experiences
with lying fake Christians. There are far too many out there giving it a
bad name.
Oh and You are allowed to tell Him you think He is wrong. Read Job &
Psalms again...there is plenty of that in there. You are allowed to do
whatever you want. But when your choice is not to follow Him, just like
not recognizing the law of gravity, there are consequences that are
natural. He has told us about them in His Word, which only a good God
would not leave us without some way to know. Paganism/Wicca/etc. are
hard without something to guide us. Whatever god is in control of those
perspectives doesn't care enough to give you His own handbook on how to
make the most of things. No one else has this. Yes, there are religious
books from other faiths, but none that claim to be from God directly.
And none that are, IMHO.
I continue to pray for you, friend. You don't have to answer this unless
you want to do the work to make our discussion based on cited facts.
Blessings with love
Shalom
2nd message; read after the other one.
Oh I forgot to tell you why I don't trust christian
websites, pamphlets, etc.
Besides being raised a christian and then feeling like I was
lie to by everyone I loved when I learned christianity is a
lie its the whole concept of the christian "God" that makes
me distrust anyone who can believe in such a being. The
whole concept of the christian "God" is that there is this
being that is so powerful that he alsways right even when
hes wrong. This to me doesn't make sense. Just because "Hes"
more powerful than me (if he existed) doesn't mean he has
any rights over me automatically. If I think hes wrong for
what ever reason I should be allowed to judge him, voice why
I think hes wrong and tell him what I think he should do
instead. Then there are only two courses of action he should
take. One; admit that hes wrong and change accordingly or
two; explain (with evidence and reason) how and why I'm
wrong. In doing the latter I would grow as a being and
become not only better but closer to him emotionally (if he
existed). Christianity teaches that to try and reason with
him will only lead to suffering and misery. Why? Because hes
all-powerful and therefore doesn't have to explain himself
or be good. He can just do what he wants. Be it flood a
world and kill all innocent new-borns. Send a plague to
punish people for not believeing the claims of Jews and
christians even though these people have carried out
countless genocides and holocausts and therefore don't
deserve respect/trust. Worst of all "Hes" meant to be a
being that cares more about what people believe rather than
how they act/live their lives.
Everything about the christian God screams evil to me and I
don't care how you interpret it, having your only son
murdered just so that you can forgive the very people who
murdered him is just wrong. I can forgive others without
having anyone sacrificed so I do without a doubt consider
myself to be more caring and intelligent than fictional
christian "God". I would forgive any who I felt truely
deserved it regardless of their love for me or lack there
of. A good person is good regardless of whom they love. I.e.
I love my deceased father. I can't help it, I don't want to
love him, he was a horrible person who tried to murder my
mom. He was a violent, abuse, theiving alcoholic and the
world is truely a better place without him (my life is even
more so) but still I can't stop myself from loving that dead
sack of s*it. That doesn't change the fact that I don't hurt
anyone, give to charity and try and be good in all the
things I do. Who you love or don't love isn't important when
it comes down to the question "Are you a good person?".
Thanks for reading
Billjohn69
Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Still praying for you
I must say that I know what you mean about not really being
interested in what you consider to be lies. I feel the same way
about reading your emails because I believe you are deceived, so it
is hard to read all the negative things you say when, just as you
feel, 'I know better'. There isn't much point in continuing if you
won't address the points I have made with the articles I have sent,
but I will try to at least address what you have recently stated to
some extent:
Yes, the commandment to honour your mother and father exists, as you
already know. But it does not include what you described. You come
up with this kind of statement out of the blue with no scriptural
references to back it up. That makes it impossible to discuss.
The same with your statements about what Messiah was to fulfill.
What Jewish eschatology are you referencing? You make statements
that have nothing substantial except your perception to back them
up. Impossible to discuss.
"Simply put the Messiah was to come and die for the Jews and when he
died the sky would darken, the earth would quake, the kingdoms of
man would fall, the knigdom of "God" shall come upon the earth, the
Jews shall inherit the earth, every Jew shall get over a thousand
slaves and the dead shall rise and be judged."
Well the sky did darken, the earth did quake, the enemy was defeated
by the fact that all men now have the Holy Spirit available upon
their acceptance of Yeshua as King to help them overcome sin (this
is an interesting phenomenon both my husband & I experienced and
continue to experience, known as the 'new creature' phenomenon). The
Kingdom of Yah will come with the New Jerusalem. The dead shall rise
& be judged, though there were some that rose immediately subsequent
to Yeshua's death. The other stuff I'd sure like to see references
for. I know it isn't from YHVH's Word.
I did not say that atheists are 'trying' to make themselves into
gods. Only that it is the result of their choice not to believe in
an ultimate creative force. You apparently don't understand my
statements on this. And it is not logical to compare to how we
relate to parents. We are talking omniscient God here. Totally
different.
I will continue in response to your next message.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Still praying for you
I wouldn't call it paranoia, its just I used to give my e-mail out but
after being bambarded with spam, junk and wierd sex ads I decided to not
give out my new one to anyone I didn't know/trust. So moving on.
Atheism; Atheists don't believe in a "God/dess(s)" of any description
because they see no reason to, not because they are trying to make
themselves into Gods. Also even when you think you know better (or
actually do know better) than someone, you are not automatically trying
to replace them. A perfect example of this is the fact that a number of
children in this world have a better understanding about average
technology (computers, game systems, etc) than their parents. This being
the case there are things they know more about than their parents and
they know what you should and shouldn't do with these things better than
their parents. This does not mean that they are trying to replace their
parents in society or life. Only that they have a better understanding
then their parents.
The links you gave me; I did go to the links you gave me (although I
didn't go much futher than the actual page you refered me too). There
wasn't much that interested me as I couldn't validate what was there
just by reading it.... alright honestly I was prejudice and decided
since they were such pro-christian sites they wouldn't be worth my time
to spend going deep into them (for reasons I'll cover in a wee bit). The
one thing I'll say here is since I turned away from christianity I have
very little trust in (what I call) christian propaganda.
The failed prophocies; I was well aware that christianity claimed Jesus
had fufiled numerous prophocies but I also know that he failed the most
important ones. The ones that make the Messiah, The Messiah. These were
the ones about the whole purpose and reason for the Messiah in
accordance with Judism. Simply put the Messiah was to come and die for
the Jews and when he died the sky would darken, the earth would quake,
the kingdoms of man would fall, the knigdom of "God" shall come upon the
earth, the Jews shall inherit the earth, every Jew shall get over a
thousand slaves and the dead shall rise and be judged. (research Jewish
Eschatology). In short the Messiah is meant to bring the end of the
world on his first coming. The second coming was made up by the
christian leaders to cover up for Jesus' failings.
Finally isn't one of the commandments of your religion "honour thy
mother and father"? Therefore isn't handing one of your parents over for
their crimes dishonouring them? Many cultures consider it so.
Thanks for reading.
Billjohn69
Re: Re:Re: Re:Still praying for you
I will try to answer you in the body of your message below. It is harder
using this venue because I cannot highlight or use a diff font, but you seem
to be rather paranoid about your email address so here we go. I will try
using all caps, but don't interpret as screaming, okay?:
Right firstly about the whole atheist thing. An atheist is someone who
truely believes there is no God/dess of any kind in existance (including
themselves). When I was calling myself an atheist I didn't worship myself, I
didn't think of myself as special, I thought I was just a human. I still
believed in being good and helping others. I still valued my life and that
of others. I still had a strong sense of morals and justice. All in all
atheism is a point of veiw. A guess at the structure of our universe, which
is to say atheism is the belief that all things have a scientific and
therefore physical explianation/cause and that no higher power exists. I now
know that such a veiw is wrong and only based on a limited understanding of
the universe, just as I know christianity (along with every other blind
faith) is as well.
THE THING ABOUT ATHEISM, AND I HAVE KNOWN SEVERAL FOR A LONG TIME, SO AM
QUITE FAMILIAR WITH THE ARGUMENTS, IS THAT WHEN ONE ASSUMES THAT ONE KNOWS
MORE THAN GOD, ONE TAKES ON THE PLACE OF GOD, SO THIS IS WHY I STATED THAT
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS ATHEISM IN REALITY. YOU MAY BELIEVE YOU DIDN'T
THINK OF YOURSELF AS SPECIAL, BUT AS SOON AS YOU ASSUME THAT THERE IS NO GOD
OVER YOU, YOU TAKE THE PLACE OF A GOD, AS YOU ARE NOW ASSUMING THAT YOU KNOW
MORE THAN A GOD WOULD. YES, MOST ATHEISTS ARE QUITE MORAL, ONLY PROVING THAT
THE SENSE OF SIN IS BUILT INTO US TO A DEGREE. I AM GLAD YOU HAVE ADVANCED
ENOUGH TO REALIZE THAT THERE IS A 'HIGHER POWER'. I THINK YOU MAY CONTINUE
IF YOU KEEP YOUR MIND OPEN RATHER THAN CLOSING IT ON A PHILOSOPHY THAT YOU
HAVE APPARENTLY NOT TRULY STUDIED IN DEPTH. READING THE BIBLE AND STUDYING
IT ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS.
Next sin. When you said that sin was "an act that offends pure holiness" you
were close but not exactly right. Sin is an act that a specific "God/dess"
deems as unacceptable. This doesn't mean its actually something that is
wrong, only that according to a certain religion(s) their "God/dess(s)"
thinks its wrong. I.e. Islam teaches its a sin to eat pigs regardless of the
fact the theres no difference in eating well cooked pork and eating any
other well cooked meat. Jehova's witness' say its a sin to donate/recieve
blood (even if it meant saving the life of a baby). Christianity teaches
that its a sin to go against the wishes of your father (honour thy mother
and father) even if hes a pedo and his wish is to rape your children (hence
why such actions were covered up so much by christian families, more so in
older days but it still happens in the christian crazy nations to this day).
Sin only exists if your "God" exists and even then just because "Hes"
offended by it doesn't actually mean that its wrong. Also just because he
condones an action, that doesn't make it right. For instance the plages of
Egypt. If these things had occured it means that your "God" thinks its
better to kill off/torture numerous people in Egypt rather than do something
sensible like teleport all of the Jews to freedom. Here (in the fictional
stories) your "God" acted like a sadistic little idiot. He could have spared
lives and done a much more effective job by saving the Jews himself but no
that was too kind/intelligent/difficult for him.
FIRST OFF, SCRIPTURE DOES NOT TEACH THAT IF THE WISHES OF YOUR FATHER ARE
AGAINST GOD'S LAW THAT ONE IS TO PROCEED TO PERFORM THEM. THERE IS NOTHING
ANYWHERE THAT SUPPORTS THAT. IF YOU KNOW OF SOMETHING, DO TELL. AGAIN, YOU
PUT YOURSELF IN THE PLACE OF YHVH/GOD WHEN YOU JUDGE HIM, BUT WHAT YOU DON'T
SEEM TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT THE EGYPTIANS HAD MADE THEIR CHOICE TO FOLLOW THE
ENEMY, THOUGH THEY HAD BEEN WARNED AGAINST IT. THESE 'STORIES' ARE LESSONS
THAT SHOW THE CONSEQUENCES OF NOT LISTENING TO YAH'S WARNINGS. THEY CAN BE
DIRE, BUT HE DID TELL THEM WHAT WAS COMING. THEY JUST DIDN'T BELIEVE IT.
THEY FOUND OUT THEY WERE WRONG. THEIR HEARTS WERE HARDENED AGAINST YAH, JUST
LIKE SO MANY ARE BY BELIEVING THEY KNOW BETTER THAN HE DOES. IT ISN'T BLIND
FAITH TO BELIEVE HIM, IT IS INTELLIGENT CHOICE BASED ON FACTS. THE FACT IS
THAT WHEN WE DON'T FOLLOW HIM, THINGS ARE HARDER AND WE ARE LESS EQUIPPED TO
COPE. THIS HAS BEEN MY EXPERIENCE. PERHAPS YOU WILL UNDERSTAND BETTER IF YOU
READ MY DETAILED TESTIMONY AT SAVEDXWITCH.COM
Also I have read the bible a number of time since the age of 12 and I'm
impressed that you said oblivion rather than Hell. Obviously you do know a
bit about what your talking about. I'm curious, do you know that Hell is
based on a Norse belief and was perverted to its modern form to control and
oppress the followers of christianity? Lol but what part of modern
christianity isn't a mixture of perverted Pagan and Jewish belief? As for
the whole wind part, I know what I said was the accurate earlier story but I
don't know how to prove it to you. The only thing I could suggest is you try
and get you hands on a physical bible that was actually printed before the
change but I'm unsure as to when the switch was actually made. Also I'm
unsure about that Young's translation. I don't know who he is and I'm
hesitant to believe his work is of any real value. I'll need to do research
on him before I can make any valid judgement.
I REALLY WISH YOU HAD READ THE LINKS I WENT TO THE TROUBLE TO SHARE WITH
YOU, AS YOU WOULD HAVE FOUND THAT I DO KNOW ABOUT THE PERVERSION OF THE
CONCEPT OF HELL. IN FACT, AS YOU ARE AWARE TO SOME EXTENT, THERE ARE MANY
PERVERSIONS INCLUDING THE HOLY DAYS, WHICH I DO NOT PARTAKE IN. I ONLY
CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS YAH GAVE US, INCLUDING PASSOVER, AND SUKKOT. YOU
SEE, BEING A FORMER PAGAN/WICCAN, IT WAS VERY CLEAR TO ME THAT THE
PHILOSOPHY HAD BEEN PERVERTED, SO I SET OUT TO FIND THE TRUTH. IT IS OUT
THERE IF ONE SINCERELY SEEKS.
Finally I have a question. What do you know of the original Jewish
prophecies about the Messiah? Like what he was to do and why he was so
important. I only ask because of the fact that Jesus never matched up to
these prophecies (hence why we still have Judism) and therefore wasn't/
couldn't have been the Messiah. This is something I think you'll find
interesting if you research it.
YESHUA (JESUS' REAL HEBREW NAME) MOST CERTAINLY DID MATCH UP TO THE
PROPHECIES, over 300 of them!:
http://lastdayscalendar.tripod.com/messianic_prophecies.htm
&
http://www.jewishvoice.org/site/PageServer?pagename=Who_is_MessianicProphecies
I HAVE RESEARCHED IT THOROUGHLY. APPARENTLY MORESO THAN YOU HAVE, FRIEND.
PLEASE COOPERATE BY AT LEAST CHECKING OUT THE LINKS I SENT BEFORE SO THAT WE
CAN CONVERSE.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
Re:Re: Re:Still praying for you
No offence but I'd rather keep the e-mails on here as I don't like giving my
private e-mail to people I don't know (never know where its going to end
up).
Right firstly about the whole atheist thing. An atheist is someone who
truely believes there is no God/dess of any kind in existance (including
themselves). When I was calling myself an atheist I didn't worship myself, I
didn't think of myself as special, I thought I was just a human. I still
believed in being good and helping others. I still valued my life and that
of others. I still had a strong sense of morals and justice. All in all
atheism is a point of veiw. A guess at the structure of our universe, which
is to say atheism is the belief that all things have a scientific and
therefore physical explianation/cause and that no higher power exists. I now
know that such a veiw is wrong and only based on a limited understanding of
the universe, just as I know christianity (along with every other blind
faith) is as well.
Next sin. When you said that sin was "an act that offends pure holiness" you
were close but not exactly right. Sin is an act that a specific "God/dess"
deems as unacceptable. This doesn't mean its actually something that is
wrong, only that according to a certain religion(s) their "God/dess(s)"
thinks its wrong. I.e. Islam teaches its a sin to eat pigs regardless of the
fact the theres no difference in eating well cooked pork and eating any
other well cooked meat. Jehova's witness' say its a sin to donate/recieve
blood (even if it meant saving the life of a baby). Christianity teaches
that its a sin to go against the wishes of your father (honour thy mother
and father) even if hes a pedo and his wish is to rape your children (hence
why such actions were covered up so much by christian families, more so in
older days but it still happens in the christian crazy nations to this day).
Sin only exists if your "God" exists and even then just because "Hes"
offended by it doesn't actually mean that its wrong. Also just because he
condones an action, that doesn't make it right. For instance the plages of
Egypt. If these things had occured it means that your "God" thinks its
better to kill off/torture numerous people in Egypt rather than do something
sensible like teleport all of the Jews to freedom. Here (in the fictional
stories) your "God" acted like a sadistic little idiot. He could have spared
lives and done a much more effective job by saving the Jews himself but no
that was too kind/intelligent/difficult for him.
Also I have read the bible a number of time since the age of 12 and I'm
impressed that you said oblivion rather than Hell. Obviously you do know a
bit about what your talking about. I'm curious, do you know that Hell is
based on a Norse belief and was perverted to its modern form to control and
oppress the followers of christianity? Lol but what part of modern
christianity isn't a mixture of perverted Pagan and Jewish belief? As for
the whole wind part, I know what I said was the accurate earlier story but I
don't know how to prove it to you. The only thing I could suggest is you try
and get you hands on a physical bible that was actually printed before the
change but I'm unsure as to when the switch was actually made. Also I'm
unsure about that Young's translation. I don't know who he is and I'm
hesitant to believe his work is of any real value. I'll need to do research
on him before I can make any valid judgement.
Finally I have a question. What do you know of the original Jewish
prophecies about the Messiah? Like what he was to do and why he was so
important. I only ask because of the fact that Jesus never matched up to
these prophecies (hence why we still have Judism) and therefore wasn't/
couldn't have been the Messiah. This is something I think you'll find
interesting if you research it.
Thanks for reading.
Billjohn69
Re: Re:Still praying for you
I used to see things the same way that you do, though I never called
myself an atheist as there really is no such thing. It's like Bob Dylan
wrote: Everybody's gonna serve somebody. Most so-called atheists are
actually worshiping themselves as gods, which is what I sort of did,
though I did believe in an ultimate creative force that I thought I was
automatically a part of. I found, as do most others, that I don't make a
very good 'god/dess'. Talk about guilt, which was what I had held
against Christianity, I really experienced it when I believed I was
responsible for everything and that I was actually in control of
reality.
I understood the 'no sin' thing. You see, the video is a short of my
entire interview, so you don't hear my explanation of the Threefold Law
and the Reed. But when one truly sees the world as it is, there is no
way to deny the existence of sin. Some of the things you so obviously
abhor - racism and hate - are most definitely sin. Because YHVH is holy
and sin is an act that offends pure holiness.
I used to think He was racist and hateful as well. My favorite comeback
was that any god who would send people to eternal torture was nothing
I'd have anything to do with. Well, I discovered as I delved deeper into
my studies that there is lots of Biblical evidence that this is not the
case. Please see:
What is Life's Final Destination?
I am not an Adventist, but rather more closely aligned as a Messianic
Believer, however I do share some of the Adventist philosophies.
There is plenty of Scripture that also indicates that He is fair and
just and does not send folks who never heard of Him to oblivion:
http://www.christian-thinktank.com/hnohear.html
I have a feeling that if you read the Bible at age 12, you may not have
been fully equipped to comprehend or even study what you were reading.
Think about giving it another shot with a good study Bible and a plan to
access Apologetics web sites. You may also want to try one that has the
literal translation to get a better meaning. I recommend Young's. I have
about 6 different versions as well as access to dozens on the web, none
of which state that the flood waters fell off the edge of the earth. I'd
be interested to be shown that reference rather than just take your word
for it. Of course, one must also keep in mind that there is much
allegory in Scripture, too, and not all is to be taken literally.
Here is Young's Literal Translation from the Greek:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%208&version=YLT
I would like to hear your replies to these points. Please contact me at
Sheepra@HCGCoach.com to continue our conversation if you please.
Blessings with love,
Shalom
Hi
Well I still feel you should have let my comment go up as I feel it was
totally valid but moving on to you message and questions. Yes I have
read the bible the whole way through. The first time I did this I was 12
and at the time I believed with all my heart that Jesus was "the truth,
the way and the life" and I decided to read the bible to better
understand the "God" I worshipped. It was on that day (after reading the
bible) that I first started calling myself an atheist. I didn't become a
Pagan until I was 17.
Let me assure you, I don't doubt that you were a witch of sorts but you
were not a Wiccan as you differed from the Wiccan path on many levels.
Also from your vid you didn't seem to understand the whole "no sin"
concept and what it really means.
As to understanding christianity heres a tip. Try and get you hands on
versions of the bible from different periods in time. You'll see that
the so called "teachings" of christianity change over time (i.e. before
the world was proven to be round the bible said that the flood waters
(from Noah's flood) were blown off the edge of the world by a great
wind. After the world was proven to be round this story was changed (in
christianity, Judism and Isalm) to say the earth cracked open to take
the waters into itself) to suit humanity at that time. My understanding
of catholism outstrips that of the Popes. My understanding of
christianity as a whole outstrips yours. How do I know this? I've read
the bible and I reject it. Thats how I know. This isn't said to
upset/insult you. Its merely a fact.
If being a member of a religion where people of said religion will force
their family members to turn away from people who truely love them, just
because they're of a different religion (as you claimed happened to you)
makes you happy, I think that makes you a pretty sad/pathetic person.
Heres the simple fact there are people in this world who never hear
about Jesus and your religion teaches that you racist, vile, evil little
"God" would punish these people for never having the chance to learn of
him (if he existed). Christianity is a religion of hate, racism and
ignorance. The fact that you enjoy this path over the open hearted one
of Paganism.... well I don't think I need to spell it out. Once again
not meant to insult just the simple facts.
Thanks for reading, hope you realise that happiness comes from within
your heart (not the physical one) not you beliefs.
Billjohn69
I did not post your comment as I believe it degenerated to insult,
and insult to my God even worse. But I would like to respond to you
as I think you still don't understand.
We could go back and forth all day as to who knows what about Wicca.
But the fact remains that I was a practicing Witch for over 20 years
which trumps whatever you think you know, my friend.
As to how YHVH can be in control and yet we still have free will,
think about it this way. He is the King. We are His subjects. We can
choose to submit to Him or not. However, He is all powerful and
ultimately in control. He loves us. He wants us to follow Him
because His Way makes our lives sooo much better in so many ways and
because the enemy will take us down with him if we follow him
instead. The enemy thrives upon our arrogance and unwillingness to
surrender to the King. When your life becomes so tedious because
your arrogance prevents you from surrendering to the King, perhaps
you will start to really study. Read The Case for Faith by Lee
Stroebel. He set out to debunk Christianity and discovered the Truth
as he researched it thoroughly. Have you ever read the Bible? I have
read it 3 times through now. Most folks don't actually read the
whole thing prayerfully requesting help to see the Truth. It is a
miraculous Book that gives wonderful blessings to the sincerely
seeking reader. I struggled at first, but I didn't give up. The
enemy makes it hard for us to understand unless we truly are seeking
the Truth and not just hoping to have our own way. I think you have
bought into the lies he has spread about our King but that you
really do want to know the Truth. Like you, I thought I was on the
right track. Boy was I wrong.
I can tell that you are still very young. I pray that the seeds that
I have planted with the help of the Holy Spirit will grow to lift
you up some day.
Blessed, healthy, prosperous & FREE BE!
B'Shem Yahushua (in the Name of Jesus),
with love & shalom from
Shalom
I am free. I've been completely free of Christianity for over 5
years. I may only have been Pagan (not Wiccan) for 5 years but I know
the difference between Wicca and what you were practising. Also how can
free will exist if "He" is in control? You clearly have a limited
understanding of reality. Blind faith only leads to ignorance. Also
don't bother praying to your lie for me. If "He" existed I'd rather go
to Hell than bow before that disgusting racist monster.
I practiced wicca for over 20 years and was trained with the first public
wiccan school & coven in the nation. How long have you been practicing to
feel you have the right to judge me? I think YHVH/God manipulated me, praise
His Holy Name, since He IS in control. I have continued to research in depth
for the last 9 years and only get closer to YHVH/God with my faith stronger
than ever! I am in prayer for your salvation!
Blessed, healthy, prosperous & FREE BE!
B'Shem Yahushua,
w/luv,
Shalom!
Her past doesn't sound like that of a Wiccan. More like a Satanist with
Neo-pagan leanings but then again all too many can't tell the difference
between different kinds of Pagan practice. Anyhow shame about people in your
life manipulating you through your loved ones to force you to change. Do
more research into the true teachings of christianity and you'll be giving
it up in no time. Blessed be.
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